Regardless of whether it is HTML, XHTML or HTML5 you find those annoying percentages littered throughout the place. Yet... I see an awful lot of websites dare not go near them. Yet I was always encouraged through uni to use them.
So which should I be using? Which would lead to better site design and why?
I'm aware to avoid the use of height although HTML5 really doesn't like me not specifying height if I want to use percentages.
Thanks for taking the time to read.
It really depends on what you do you want to build up.
Sometimes I need to build a website which could be read by people with certain disabilities. If for example also older people visit your site its good to use % so that they could zoom in your page and the layout still looks pretty.
Fixed Design Layouts Fixed design layouts have a specific width and do
not scale to fit the browser window. Websites that make use of it can
be aligned to the left, centre or even aligned to the right as and
when required.
Benefits of Fixed layouts: With fixed design layouts you have control
over the line length, flow and placement of the elements on the web
page. The designer has a fixed space to work with and the line lengths
of the text and the placement of images can be designated easily.
Drawbacks of Fixed layouts: Fixed design layouts tend to leave lots of
empty space on either side of the design when viewed on high screen
resolutions. This dwarfs the size of the web page and gives an
impression that it is floating on the screen.
Fluid Layout Fluid design layouts use percentages instead of pixels to
define their width and they fill the entire browser window. They are
also called fixed or dynamic designs.
Benefits of Fluid layouts: One of the major benefits of fluid design
layouts is their accessibility features. They cater to more number of
users. This is because, whatever may be the screen resolution or
device of the user, fixed design layouts adapt better. It makes use of
the entire browser window by spreading out. This maximizes the area
for the content to e displayed and more information can be seen at one
go. Therefore, there is no empty space on the window screen. This is a
better bet as compared to fixed layouts that leave a great deal of
empty space.
For fonts, you should use percentages (or em's, or rems) if you don't wish to fix the font size in Internet Explorer. If you use pixels, then users of Internet Explorer who change their default font size in their browser settings won't see the fonts increase/decrease. So this makes your text potentially less readable for users in that browser.
A great resource for this is the first chapter of Dan Cederholm's Bulletproof Web Design.
For layout, using percentages or em's will make your design more flexible to changing font sizes/localization etc. This is also covered in the book.
I am attempting to create a webpage formatted to fit the width of all screen
sizes (or resolutions).
In other words, I want to format the width of my page in such a way that anyone who views it will not have to use a horizontal scroll bar at the bottom of the screen.
So far, I have found no help on this topic.
Well, there are several approaches. One would be to use ems/percentages for your widths thus achieving a fluid design that adopts to your users screen resolution. The other is to have several css sheets for different widths and call them based upon a screen resolution check from a simple js code.
The first one is a bit harder, but yields good stable results. On the other hand, (as a designer) it kinda restricts your creativity a bit.
It seems to me like the latter is more widely used. Nowadays, 3 different stylesheets will suffice for most devices around the world. One around 900px will cover somewhat older screens, one around 1160px will handle the larger and more modern screens, and one for mobile devices(sorry, no idea on approximate width) should do the trick.
The way you're asking this question, not only will the width of the body have to be 100%, but the width of its the child elements will also have to be in percentages.
The only way to achieve a scalable web page is by avoiding fixed sizes. Of course that presents problems with text since it will attempt to wrap it on the following lines, so you must either specify a minimum width or combine it with a pre tag with overflow: hidden so that it won't affect your page layout at the expense of simply not being able to read the text.
Fortunately, you can easily test your page by simply shrinking your web browser to smaller resolutions and seeing how it pans out.
I am creating a website and would like to get the opinion of some of the more experienced web developers.
How does one create a website where the element style attributes (padding, margin, height, width, etc) are appropriate for the users screen resolution?
With CSS i get to choose one value and that is the final value which will be displayed for all users, regardless of their browsing resolution.
For example, say i would like an image to be displayed 10% to the left of its container i would do the following: padding-left: 15%; Now, that may work fine for some resolutions but for others i may need that value to be higher.
What do more experienced web developers do in regards to screen resolution differences?
It sounds like your goal is to have your layout look literally the same at any resolution, which isn't really practical. Remember that images scale poorly! What most designers do is use percentages where possible to allow the layout to "flow" to fit most resolutions while remaining attractive.
If you analyze (for example) Stack Overflow. you'll see that it is a fixed-width set that is itself centered in the browser. Apple does the same thing, with some art elements that are displayed gracefully at any window width. It's an artistic problem, and I'm not sure the answer can be given with any more clarity than that.
It depends entirely on your design goals.
Most designers use fixed-width areas and let it center on the screen.
In some cases you can use CSS media-queries to apply specific rules to different types and sizes of screens (browser support is limited).
You can use min/max-width to handle many cases of content growing too large or small - but there is no equivalent for margins.
SVG graphics can be used to provide scalable images that look good at any resolution.
Some companies provide an entirely separate site for mobile users.
There are other tips and tricks but in general most designers avoid these issues by using fixed-width layouts - even though that's not always ideal.
I usually define those styles in em units, which are relative to the font size. So, increasing the text size increases padding & margins proportionately.
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I'm making a website now and I am trying to decide if I should make it fluid or not. Fixed width websites are much easier to make and also much easier to make them appear consistent.
To be honest though, I personally prefer looking at fluid websites that stretch to the full width of my monitor. My question comes from the fact that in most modern browsers you can hold control and scroll your mouse wheel to basically resize any website.
So is creating a fluid website worth the trouble?
It depends on your audience and your content.
The following are sites I respect and I think are example to imitate.
Fluid Examples:
Amazon
Wikipedia
Static Examples:
Apple
eBay
MSN
StackOverflow
MSDN
Some Mix it Up!
CNN
I think I prefer static most of the time. It is easier to make it look good in more browsers. It is also easier to read.
Making a website fluid, but adding a min/max-width attribute seems to be the best of both worlds, for me. You support fluidity, but you limit it at a certain width (say, 800px and 1200px).
It is up to you - here are some things to consider:
Text is hard(er) to read when lines are very long.
Your audience may have larger or smaller resolutions than normal, and picking an 'incorrect' static width will annoy them.
Maintaining a fluid site can be, but doesn't have to be much more difficult than its static counterpart.
Absolutely. It is a big inconvenience to people with huge monitors to have to resize the page. It can also be a bit dodgy with some layouts. Little inconveniences, no matter how trivial, can actually affect people's opinions of your site.
Also, netbooks have odd resolutions which make it hard to design sites for. For example, I'm writing this at 1024x600.
It's not particularly hard nowadays either (in modern browsers), especially with min- and max-height in CSS, and the new gradients, etc in CSS3, so image scaling won't be as big a problem in the near future.
In response to the comment below, I think that the pros outweigh the cons in this particular case - IE6 is a problem everywhere. We just have to deal with it.
You have to realize most computer users don't even KNOW HOW to zoom in the browser! Most users are so far from the understanding of computers that we have. We always have to remember that fact.
Text based apps: No. Table based apps: Yes.
Pros of fluid layouts
People with big monitors gets to use their screen real estate.
Easier for users with big monitors when you have a lot of information on your page.
Cons of fluid layouts:
A fluid width text column is hard to read if it's too wide. There's a good reason behind the use of columns in newspapers: it makes skipping to the next line much, much easier.
(Somewhat) hard to implement, because of the limitations in CSS.
If you're showing tabular data (iTunes, db manager, ...), fluid width is good. If you're showing text (articles, wiki pages, ...) fluid width is bad.
From my iPhone's perspective, fixed width layout is problematical when using code blocks. The scrollbar for wide code blocks doesn't show up, so I can't read the far right of the block.
Otherwise, I think it's a simple matter of what kind of site you're designing and how it looks on different size screens and windows. As previously mentioned, there's an option to set a maximum width, but the same caveat applies to code blocks and iPhones. I've designed both, and I don't prefer one over the other.
Although, it's fun to watch the boxes move around as I play with the browser size with a fluid layout, but I can be easily amused.
The most important thing is to consider dominant use cases of your web site or application. Do you expect people to use it exclusively on mobile devices? Mobile phones, netbooks, desktops?
Take a look at "Responsive Web Design" by Ethan Marcotte: http://www.alistapart.com/articles/responsive-web-design/
Great article that demonstrates the use of truly fluid layouts using media-queries. Sometimes you need to built out a separate front end for different user-agents, but sometimes media-queries are the perfect tool to service multiple resolutions across different user-agents.
It depends on what you're trying to do. Take a look at SO. It's fixed width and it's great. In fact, if it were fluid, it would be a bit of a PITA. Some sites look better with fluid layouts, but personally, I'd go with fixed unless you have a good reason to go fluid.
Many good points in the comments but from your question it seems you really like fluid designs and want to create one so go for it, it's your site, it doesn't have to be like every other site on the web.
Just be aware of pros ond cons of every solution.
Up to a point - yes.
There's a certain width, where text begins to become annoying to read if it's too wide. Easy to test if you have a large monitor, just grab notepad and paste some text into it without line breaks.
However, when going down to smaller sizes, being fluid might be a good idea. Mobile phone browsers are more and more capable of displaying "normal" websites just fine, but they are sometimes width-constrained, and as such, benefit if your site can fit in a bit smaller space.
Personally I also like to keep browser on my monitor but only at half of the monitor's width (24"). Sites which scale nicely into that are very good.
I think it's mostly a user convenience case. Not all sites will benefit from being fluid, but I think sites which have lots of text content are the ones that will most benefit from it, at least if they are fluid up to a max width (say 800px or whatever)
Yes. Page zooming is great but it is primarily used to make text bigger, not to make text fill the viewport. Certainly if the body text is already too wide, zooming down to make it fit will usually make it unreadable.
You need liquid layout if you're going to make the text fit the viewport whether or not it's zoomed.
The point about ‘long lines being hard to read’ is often overstated by designers trying to justify fixed width designs(*), but in reality it doesn't seem to hold quite as strongly on-screen as it did on paper. Of course setting a good leading/line-height is important, and max-width can be used to inhibit the worst excesses of long lines. (Set it in font-relative em units.) You don't get max-width in IE6, but that's not the disaster it once was. (You can fix it with a little bit of JavaScript if you really care about those guys. I don't.)
(* which are indeed less work for highly graphical layouts. But for a simpler layout like, er, StackOverflow's, there isn't really any reason not to go liquid. Tsk #SO, eh!)
Preface: Not a professional web artist.
I've found that there's way too many fiddly bits to get things to flow just so at cell-phone and uber-widescreen sizes, especially in anything of reasonably interesting complexity.
Typically, I design around having a fixed-width site in some fashion; usually bounded at [600,1200].
I also find super-wide columns of content to be a hassle to read. I seem to remember that there's some research which suggests an optimal number of words per column line.
You can make it like this.
# Make the main layout fluid and apply 'max-width: 1140px' to it and center it.
By this there won't be 'long lines' of text on bigger screens and proper settlement of web page on smaller ones (excluding 800x*** and lowers).
I have implemented this method in my new projects and it's working like a charm.
a.t.b .. :)
I think the decision fluid/fixed should be based also on content of the website:
For sites with big amounts of plain
information (like news portals),
better to use fluid layout.
Web-services better look and work in
fixed dimensions, so you always know
where interface elements are located
in their places and they are not moving
around constantly.
Yes, fluid websites are worth creating
As you said, it looks good and reasonable when you plan properly at design phase.
Your doubt about the impact of Ctrl + Scrollbar is not a big deal.
This feature is primarily for accessibility, to make text more readable by increasing the size.
However, if you mention all your sizes in Pixels (px) it won't happen.
Proper adjustment happens only when you use "em" to specify size. So you have a way to turn it on/off
I'm a big fan of fixed at < 800px... it's easier to read narrower columns, and it will work anywhere. That is, if you're trying to make a website that presents hypertext... Websites which present application front-ends, are I think another can of worms entirely...
Fluid design - truly fluid - is hard. Very hard. It's not just a question of page width - do your fonts scale, and does everything scale with them? Ideally:
Sizes should be defined in em rather than px
...and that goes for element sizes, not just fonts!
Given a change in font size or zoom level, the page elements should be the same size relative to each other
Our main product is fluid, and it's a pain from my point of view as a designer, especially because it involves a lot of user-generated content.
For one thing, images - in a fixed-width site, you can have an image that fills half the width, and looks great. In a fluid site, this image is just as likely to be lost in a sea of whitespace, looking rather lonely.
Life should be easier once border-radius and other CSS3 properties come into play more, but sadly our core audience are government workers, who all, ALL STILL USE IE F#!*ING 6!
To answer the question, "is it worth it"? Yes, if you do it right.
Here's a scenario: choose a fixed-width site: your boss displays it to a client on his brand-new, 1920x1600 laptop, then complains to you about "how it all looks small on this guy's screen!"
I think it's nice to be able to scale well on a user's screen, rather than make the users pan and zoom. In a time when users surf the web from such a wide variety of devices, ranging from smartphones to ultra-mobile PCs, each with its own, possibly non-standard resolution, I think it's important to keep user-experience at a high level when your site is viewed on such screens. Regarding the text length, it could be bounded by a certain ratio, so it would fit nicely within the layout. I think there are also frameworks that may help with writing a site in a fluid manner, and help with coding maintainability.
I'm gonna go against the majority and say NO. Reasoning: fluid sites like Wikipedia are a nightmare to read on large screens due to their long line length (though its citations make it hard to read at the best of times).
The problem really occurs because there is no mechanism to size text relative to the screen resolution. If you could automatically make text bigger on bigger resolutions, you could stay closer to the 80-odd characters per line that's generally regarded as the best for readability.
There is also the problem of images and other fixed-size elements. You can have large images and let the browser shrink them if necessary, but then you run into other problems like much longer download times, and image quality problems in many browsers.
I'm a fan of sites that do have a fixed max width of between 800px - 1000px, but can also scale down so that I can read the content without scrolling side-to-side and also without zooming out because often the text becomes too small to read and it hurts my eyes. So, this is normally want I strive for because I want to build sites I can be proud of.